By: bbb_0192
21/08/2007
7:01 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Holocaust victims living in poverty in Israeli.
The Israeli government has been criticised for "severe shortcomings" in its treatment of elderly holocaust survivors.
A report from the state comptroller's office blamed red tape for preventing effective assistance being provided and urged action to help the ageing victims.
Leopold Rosen measures the world by the pipe that connects him to his oxygen machine. He suffers from several chest complaints dating back to when he hid from the Nazis in a forest in Poland.
The German government pays him compensation every month and he gets a small pension from Israel, but he can barely pay for both his drugs and his food.
"I was born of the 5th of June, 1922. Do I have time to wait for help from the government? There are a lot of people in the same position. They don't have time to wait," he told Al Jazeera.
Holocaust survivors have been trying to embarrass the Israeli government into action.
At a recent event, protesters wore symbols from the Nazi-era to drive home their point.
There are about one quarter of a million Holocaust survivors in Israel and official figures say that one in three of them live below the poverty line.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/8606B5EE-86 E8-40B9-82D9-83F783A4F0D5.htm |
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By: grumblestop65
21/08/2007
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| Shirer posits that there ere were between 31,000,000 and 49,000,000 deaths in the second world war |
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By: solambel
21/08/2007
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By: grumblestop65
4 minutes ago
Re:Holocaust trauma 'affects descendants ... (PREVIEW)
Shirer posits that there ere were between 31,000,000 and 49,000,000 deaths in the second world war
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>
Nobody knows for sure the number, but that is just about the count. |
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By: bbb_0192
21/08/2007
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A Factual Appraisal Of
The 'Holocaust'
By The Red Cross
Not All Were Interned
Volume III of the Red Cross Report, Chapter 3 (I. Jewish Civilian Population) deals with the "aid given to the Jewish section of the free population," and this chapter makes it quite plain that by no means all of the European Jews were placed in internment camps, but remained, subject to certain restrictions, as part of the free civilian population.
http://www.vancouver.indymedia.org/news/2004/03/12 2056.php |
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By: bbb_0192
21/08/2007
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Holocaust Denial Law
in Britain for the first time, carrying a prison sentence of two years or more.
Europe wants to harmonise laws before a new arrest warrant comes into force in 2004. This will allow police to send citizens of the 15 member states for trial anywhere in the EU without old-style extradition procedures
Risks of a law on Holocaust denial
unfortunately the controversy over Germany's proposal to make Holocaust denial a criminal offence across Europe (Report, January 16) will just keep on the back burner - where it has been for five years - the essential European law against race-hate crime, into which Germany wishes to incorporate this offence.
Instead, Germany should ensure the EU cracks down on those who make the daily lives of Jewish, black, Asian and Roma Europeans a misery through harassment and violence.
If criminalisation of Holocaust denial is made the priority, the sufferings of those who often endure violent hate crime risk not getting the urgent attention and action they deserve at EU level.
Sarah Ludford MEP
London, Liberal Democrat
The German proposal to ban the display of the swastika across the EU is uncalled for. While no sane person can overlook the Nazis' heinous crimes and the association of this symbol with them, the bona fide meaning of swastika should not be overshadowed. The word is derived from the Sanskrit words su (good) and vasti (being). Hence many of us Indians find it rather unfortunate that this auspicious symbol of India has become a symbol of disrepute.
Dr Upinder Fotadar
New York University
http://www.guardian.co.uk/letters/story/0,,1996513 ,00.html |
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By: nessa_sarily_so
21/08/2007
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shirl....I apologise. I in no way am attempting to trivialise the holocaust.
The post is about the family's of victims suffering generations past the events. By going over it and over it, they are traumatising their children. Passing on the pain.
I lived next to a survivor family who fled Germany. They were safe here. They wanted their children to feel safe and they were.
Its very much the same case with a lot of family's or returned soldiers. You wouldn't dare bring up the Japanese around any of them.
I did say don't forget it. Still I think the young can be spared the pain. |
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By: shir2lou
21/08/2007
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nessa_sarily_so
You are not the problem and sorry if you took it as that.
But those who are the hateful anti-Semited know who thye are.
Unfortuately, it is affecting not only the second generation but the third too.
My daughter is a teacher at the largest Jewish school in Australia and many third generation children are still having problems. The insecurities having been passed on. |
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By: shir2lou
21/08/2007
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nessa_sarily_so
You are not the problem and sorry if you took it as that.
But those who are the hateful anti-Semited know who thye are.
Unfortuately, it is affecting not only the second generation but the third too.
My daughter is a teacher at the largest Jewish school in Australia and many third generation children are still having problems. The insecurities having been passed on. |
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By: wharfy_7000
21/08/2007
7:55 pm |
Message deleted. Reason: Profanity |
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By: tohardforme2000
21/08/2007
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| Nutjobs like wharfy 7000 make them feel insecure. |
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By: themthebrakes
21/08/2007
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Question has making people fee guilty stop any of the mistreatment of others around the world or has it just added fuel to the fire ?
We should move on as most people are dead the youth of Germany are sick and tied of having their nose rubbed in something that happen long before most were born, will they be force to pay forever?
Will this bring into being another Hitler down the track, after all the Germans came to hate the Jews that’s how Hitler got his power, as youth can no understand the pain of the past, but they can understand the pain of feeling guilty that can easily turn into hate, No one like to be blame for something they didn’t do.
Its time to treat all victims equal there is no gage to judge some one as being a Victim more then the other person. |
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By: cantgetaloginname
22/08/2007
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***
I am furious here at the attitude of some of you people……..you should be totally ashamed of yourselves. I am just appalled.
***
I am very sorry if what I'd said offended you; I truly did not intend to trivialise the Holocaust. My point was rather that the Holocaust is just one of many atrocities to have been carried out in human history. Genocide has been going on for thousands of years and we tend to forget the less "popular" ones. How many people know that the Afrikaaner people out South Africa were put into concentration camps by the British South Africans? Their suffering and torment was no better or worse than the treatment of the Jews, disabled, coloured, or homosexual people at the hands of the Nazis. Many other tortured people have been overlooked and have had to "get over it" because they had no choice.
Luckily Holocaust deniers are rare, but I think it utterly stupid to outlaw opining such. I am no history expert on the Holocaust, but as a general rule I distrust any "history" written solely by the winners of any conflict or war. Airbrushing historical facts is dangerous; because we can only hope that we as intelligent human beings can learn from past mistakes. |
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By: oggster8606
22/08/2007
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"Luckily Holocaust deniers are rare, but I think it utterly stupid to outlaw opining such. I am no history expert on the Holocaust, but as a general rule I distrust any "history" written solely by the winners of any conflict or war. Airbrushing historical facts is dangerous; because we can only hope that we as intelligent human beings can learn from past mistakes."
The Holocaust is something that should be continued to be studied and researched - although even this has been brought into question these days as a "revisionist".
Surely any new research and writing about history is revision?
To compare further research to "Holocaust denial" is quite simply wrong - especially when we have more information than ever before about exactly what did happen. |
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By: cantgetaloginname
22/08/2007
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Exactly Oggster. Revisioning history when more factual evidence appears is a good thing; just as long as it's done completely without bias. There's too much PC-revisionism going on, like with the African African slavery history in the US.
UNBIASED, people! Is it really so hard? We can't diddle with history just because someone might get offended. We kick up a storm when muslims do it for history relating to Islam, so why should anyone else be allowed to get away with it? |
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By: maree1700
22/08/2007
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| Solambel I will not ignore racist or religious taunts which are illegal under the anti-discrimination act 1975. This forum should be subject to the same rules as TV, print media or radio. This is a G rated site accessed by young jews, those who survived the holocaust and their families. The filth written here does not deserve to be seen. If these posters are so brave let them come out from behind the safety of their PC's and take it into the public domain. They won't because they would be arrested so why then should it be ok here? not acceptable solombel. |
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By: wharfy_7000
22/08/2007
5:04 pm |
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By: gator_risen
22/08/2007
5:13 pm |
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By: gator_risen
22/08/2007
5:17 pm |
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By: gator_risen
22/08/2007
5:18 pm |
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By: md_rose_anne
22/08/2007
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I'm not trivialising the Holocaust, its survivors or their families' problems ... but the POW's of S.E. Asia suffered equally traumatising experiences at the hands of their Japanese captors - but nobody sees or hears of their families being maladjusted. To cap it off, the Japanese are notorious for their denial of their actions in WW2. As someone suggested earlier, look up Nanjing or Japanese War Crimes - the Japanese hierarchy TO THIS DAY deny the atrocities they perpetrated. At least the Germans acknowledge what the Nazis did!
Peace,
rose anne. |
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By: solambel
22/08/2007
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By: maree1700
49 minutes ago
Re:Holocaust trauma 'affects descendants ... (PREVIEW)
Solambel I will not ignore racist or religious taunts which are illegal under the anti-discrimination act 1975. This forum should be subject to the same rules as TV, print media or radio. This is a G rated site accessed by young jews, those who survived the holocaust and their families. The filth written here does not deserve to be seen. If these posters are so brave let them come out from behind the safety of their PC's and take it into the public domain. They won't because they would be arrested so why then should it be ok here? not acceptable solombel.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>
Nobody said you should ignore racists or religious taunts, maree, but you have firmly fixed it in your mind that only whites can be racists - right? If we were, we would still be a socalled white Australia. But those coming here gather in enclaves and stay among themselves, away from us socalled white racists. Think about that! Secondly, you more often than not call on the mods to ban those you disagree with. That is definitely signs of immaturity. Be a bit more street smart! About the G-rated part of it - it's no different from television, maree. G-ratings are there for juveniles and as such their parents should be in control of them. There are places, like here, where nobody should tell us to moderate our views because of certain young people - in this case where you name young Jews - could be upset. Bit like you want to ban all night life in the cities because of youngsters could be exposed to it prematurely and affected by it. |
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By: yfancythat
22/08/2007
10:14 pm |
Message deleted. Reason: Offtopic |
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By: bbb_0192
22/08/2007
11:19 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| The Holocaust happened, and it was extraordinarily. Plenty of people, including non-jews died saddening that it happened. My sympathy lies with the 1940s Jews. Not the ones that jump on the band wagon, many people need help in this world so lets give it equal to all, who has been traumatized some say it is just a poly to keep the holocaust in peoples faces it is a billion dollar Industry. |
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By: shir2lou
22/08/2007
11:28 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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I can't believe you think that, let alone said it.
Speak with some Holocaust survivors and then you'll change your tune. |
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By: givemeanidnow_07
23/08/2007
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My sympathy lies with the 1940s Jews. Not the ones that jump on the band wagon,
It’s sad but true that what was a terrible tragedy has turned into an industry. You have to admire the survivors for picking themselves up and getting on with their lives. They certainly deserve our respect. However, there seems to be a lot of bandwagon jumpers who deserve nothing but contempt. |
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