By: aprilhud123
11/07/2008
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Mr Henson will make one of his most public outings since the storm over his exhibition erupted when he launches an exhibition at the National Gallery of Australia this evening.
buzzanddidj:
Just watch this individual show his arrogance to-wards the people that have objected to his so called art, after all he; and his ilk think that they are above such matters, and the rest of us are uneducated foul people that can be dismissed.
They have forgotten that it is us that purchase their art, and only if we like it. |
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By: buzzanddidj
11/07/2008
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'A PROMINENT child psychologist says art critic Robert Nelson failed as a parent by allowing nude photos of his daughter to be published.
His attack came as the father of the naked girl depicted on the cover of Art Monthly magazine has written of the "diabolically sexual" potential in child images.
Michael Carr-Gregg said no six-year-old has the maturity to understand the consequences of their naked image being published.'
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,240 02978-661,00.html
Michael Carr-Gregg is a columnist and 'agony-aunt' for
'DOLLY' and 'GIRLFRIEND' magazines
And you can't argue with THOSE credentials
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By: buzzanddidj
11/07/2008
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'Mr Henson will make one of his most public outings since the storm over his exhibition erupted when he launches an exhibition at the National Gallery of Australia this evening.
buzzanddidj:
Just watch this individual show his arrogance to-wards the people that have objected to his so called art, after all he; and his ilk think that they are above such matters, and the rest of us are uneducated foul people that can be dismissed'
By: aprilhud123
Bill Henson used his first public speech since the furore over his photographs of naked children to explore the contradictory nature of the medium and people's reactions to it.
Speaking to a large and supportive crowd at the opening of a photographic exhibition chronicling the Asia-Pacific from the 1840s to the 1940s at the National Gallery of Australia in Canberra last night, the controversial artist said art had the power to challenge prejudices.
"The greatness of art comes from the ambiguities, which is another way of saying it stops us from knowing what to think," Henson said. "It redeems us from a world of moralism and opinionation and claptrap."
Henson's speech made pointed references to the art censorship row that his exhibition helped reignite. "Nothing kills the thing we love quite so perfectly as our assumption that we always know what's best, what is right for someone else, whether it's another person or another culture."
"People do sometimes only see what they want to," Henson said. He recalled the comments he made when he opened an exhibition of photographs by August Sander: "Beware the loss of mid-tones."
He said: "We should be absolutely clear that we cannot know, or fully grasp, the experience that others have when they are alone - staring quietly and intently into this strange little mirror on the world - when they bring life experience to bear in each encounter with a photograph."
http://www.smh.com.au/news/arts/henson-defends-art /2008/07/10/1215658038111.html
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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"However, who can say at what age a person is old enough to make certain decision? Laws exist to protect the child from others, not to stifle the child from themselves."
When the child is a legal adult, which I believe is 18 in this country. |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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| it can be argued that many at this age are not emotionally capable still, but I guess you have to let them go sometime. |
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By: greatgranswisdom
11/07/2008
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<<<Same principle here I believe, the child's body belongs to the child, and the child only, the parents do NOT have the right to expose their child to things he/she may not approve of once they grow into maturity>>>
Leethal ...could I say I suppose this depends on the nature of the society in which the child will be living.
You must have missed my comment on visible skin.
In the Naturist experience....and yes, I'm very familiar with this...... all of the children that I know of, that grew up in a Naturist environment, have become model citzens, with exceptionally stable lives and marriages.
What does this tell me?
Most parents expose children to things which others deem undesirable.
e.g, I see it as undesirable to use a forceful level of pressure towards children to take part in a body contact sport......but it is socially acceptable for them to do so.
Of course, nothings perfect, and that includes Naturism.
The Clubs affiliated with the International Naturist Federation would come close.
e.g., the train and car incidents you mention, which occurred in everyday society, simply wouldn't happen in a Naturist environment. Let's just say that it would be nipped in the bud before it took place....and that would also have mean't that someone had slipped through "the net".
Over the last 20 years, photography has become more strictly controlled in INF affiliated clubs. Even in non affiliated resorts etc., in south Eastern Europe, anyone taking a photograph of anyone without their written permission, and then making the image public, would run the risk of being sued.
Anyway, Naturism is a peripheral matter here.
I particularly don't like Henson's photos-in-question.
The image, which is the subject of this thread, is to me, a pleasant, simple, photograph...and nothing more than that...and will probably be rated PG by the censor...I'd rate it G.
Incidentally, is there a censorship problem with children smiling? |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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"Nothing kills the thing we love quite so perfectly as our assumption that we always know what's best, what is right for someone else, whether it's another person or another culture."
"People do sometimes only see what they want to," Henson said. He recalled the comments he made when he opened an exhibition of photographs by August Sander: "Beware the loss of mid-tones."
Arrogant is right, and ilustrates my point peerfectly, he and the parents took it upon themselves to do exactly what he accuses us of to a minor. |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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| Oh I agree Gran in a naturist society the implications and reactions will be totallt different, but we are speaking of our socity's context... sorry I semed to have missed your point |
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By: ripfelix
11/07/2008
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| Point is Gran likes to get like the natives and run around in the nude. Nothing wrong with that, but dont pretend that there are no sicko naturists. As for forcing children to run around naked with strangers, not quite the same as making them play footy is it. |
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By: greatgranswisdom
11/07/2008
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<<<but we are speaking of our society's context... sorry I seemed to have missed your point>>>
leeethal.....My point was , that all children will be exposed to parental pressure which others deem undesirable.
My example was body contact sport....but the possibilities are limitless.
e.g.,....One of my cappuccino buddies was forced, as a child, to eat food she didn't want, both in type and quantity, by her parents.....and blames this on her lifelong struggle with obesity.
Some would suggest that mixing both sexes....children and adults.....without covering, is undesirable.
Some say no images of humans should exist, at various ages, unless they are clothed.
It really comes down to what society dictates.....and societies....with current global cultural mixing....are in a constant state of flux.
I don't see the cover photo in question.....even with its sensationalisation, and the massive attention it has received..... has the potential to cause any more psychological damage to the subject than a myriad of other parental dictates.....many of which appear to be more socially acceptable.
I think the only potential risk for the girl, is the barrage of abuse from everywhere.
And that, I see, as entirely the fault of our society's lack of....and I hate the word.....acceptance.
Anyway....I'm taking lots of fish oil, walk 5 k's a day on my treadmill, and intend to be around for another 15 years...so we'll see how she makes out. |
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By: greatgranswisdom
11/07/2008
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<<<Point is Gran likes to get like the natives and run around in the nude. Nothing wrong with that, but dont pretend that there are no sicko naturists.>>>
I'll resist ignoring this...and just say.....
Probably right ripflex.....but I never encountered any.....the "sicko" indicaters would have to be concealed with the powers of Houdini. |
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By: greatgranswisdom
11/07/2008
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| sorry...."indicators" ....How did I pass with honours in Leaving Certificate English? |
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By: ripfelix
11/07/2008
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Gran, I have nothing but respect for your views and dialogue. My only exception was a generalisation that no naturists were sicko's. I think the very nature of naturists (can I say that, it sounds wrong) will attract a questionable element. As a young man I'd happily strut Maslins beach in my glory (with a girlfriend mind you) and be a bit concerned by some of the older men who would camp around us, and want to strike up conversations about nudism.
I agree, it not right to tar all naturists with the same brush, but I certainly would be apprehensive to take my children with me. |
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By: aprilhud123
11/07/2008
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buzzanddidj
Thank you for your response; however, my stand in this is not that fact that the artist painted her Daughter; it is the fact that the magazine printed this only to make a point of showing us that he could; and given that this publication attracts public funding; this was indeed a brave and foolish act, just to make a futile point. |
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By: dazedlady2003
11/07/2008
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it can be argued that many at this age are not emotionally capable still, but I guess you have to let them go sometime.
_________________________ _________________________ _____________
I agree that they are not emotionally capable, I work with children this age, let me tell you, the last thing on their mind is strutting around in the nude. They are more concerned with climbing trees, making cubby houses, or playing with their x boxes, Nintendos etc, and trying to outdo the next kid with their latest toys. While I have heard things about lovey boy girl crushes etc and a very occasional comment about sex, not one has ever discussed posing nude.
I actually asked a few parents for their views about this subject. There was not the slightest hesitation in rejecting the idea of publicly displaying a nude portrait of their child.
This child is modelling parental behaviour and beliefs, sadly, some of the beliefs are outside the boundaries of public taste. End of Story. |
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By: dazedlady2003
11/07/2008
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Michael Carr-Gregg is a columnist and 'agony-aunt' for
'DOLLY' and 'GIRLFRIEND' magazines
And you can't argue with THOSE credentials
_________________________ _________________________ ________
Michael Carr-Gregg also works in television and radio. Not just those two airhead mags. |
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By: us_walters
11/07/2008
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Buzz... Henson made his appearance & said nothing to the media ??? isn't your word self promotion a good thing ???
Why did he leave 10 minutes after his spoke ???
It was his exhibition.... Ran in, Ran out..very strange |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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ahh sorry Gran I seem to be posting in a fog today, so I'll give it another go..
I don't object to the photo itself at all, many parents take pictures of their kids in this way, that's their choice, and as long as it is just to record the beauty of the child at that age fine (not in a sexual context).
Its not my choice, because my daughter would be mortified at such a request I'm sure, and although she is comfortable with her body, she has always been a very private person, and would I'm sure refuse to be recorded this way.
It's the decision to take away her stewardship of her own body I object to, so that same principle applies to people who force their kids into ANY activity against their will. As always there are things that breach this to a lesser or greater degree.
The intent of the mother is also something I object to, she did not publish the photo with the main aim of celebrating her beauty and innocence(should never have been public in my opinion, but some may differ), but to support Henson's much more offensive photographs, to cause a stir, and possibly even just to make a quid.
Hope this is clearer
I would never sell out one of my friends under such conditions let alone my child. |
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By: longweekend58
11/07/2008
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<it can be argued that many at this age are not emotionally capable still, but I guess you have to let them go sometime.>
the irony is that in this great push for child protection, the childs opinion matters nought. IM wondering exactly who and what we are protecting. Our own liberal guilt after decades of ignoring the problem? |
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By: buzzanddidj
11/07/2008
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'The intent of the mother is also something I object to, she did not publish the photo with the main aim of celebrating her beauty and innocence(should never have been public in my opinion, but some may differ), but to support Henson's much more offensive photographs, to cause a stir, and possibly even just to make a quid.'
This photograph is part of the artist's Dreamchild series, 2003, which has been exhibited in Bendigo, New York, Perth, Sydney and Melbourne. Papapetrou was recently represented in the exhibition Presumed Innocence: Photographic Perspectives of Children, De Cordova Museum and Sculpture Park, Lincoln, Massachusetts, USA, 2 February to 27 April 2008.
http://www.artmonthly.org.au/
An artist is not paid to have their work shown in Art Monthly Australia magazine
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By: longweekend58
11/07/2008
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| it is uncomfortable agreeing with you 100%, Buzz! LOL |
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By: buzzanddidj
11/07/2008
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'it is uncomfortable agreeing with you 100%, Buzz! LOL'
By: longweekend58
Oh........
You probably like dogs as well |
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By: longweekend58
11/07/2008
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| labrador/retreiver dog here. psychopath too. |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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| I knew she wasn't paid to be in magazine Buzz, but the ensuing publicity and possibly interview payments can't be hurting...(again you may correct on the latter if you wish it's a guess) and on the other point's I wasn't aware she had already exhibited elsewhere, but if it was her intention so simply show innocence.. then why the timing? |
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By: leeethal2
11/07/2008
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| Oh and I like to dogs too.. AND cats...lol |
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