By: chuck_u_feney
10/07/2008
11:18 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Nudity and sexual arousal are chalk and cheese. |
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By: chuck_u_feney
10/07/2008
11:19 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| not counting salma hayek |
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By: aprilhud123
10/07/2008
12:19 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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"but NOT for a six year old to be exploited in a sexual way"
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Sexual?
Well ... if you say so.
Close your eyes and consider this; see this poor little girl's pose; and change her to a 20 year old, now that would be acceptable since a 20 year old can “make up her own mind”. |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
12:40 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Re: >> By: greatgranswisdom
Today (8:06 am) <<
Firstly, note that because Gran's post was just below the Y7 character limit, leaving no room for Thy comments in reply...
Looking back on these events as an adult and a parent, what could and should have been done seems obvious, however, one important reason why they were raised in the first instance (although not well-articulated) was because the then innocent children/teens involved did NOT act in a remotely sensible way...
* Re the bloke in the car, we reported it to the school, principal made an announcement - then the friend and I proceeded to walk home SEPARATELY the next day. Not rational - but we were only 12!
* Re the bloke masturbating on the train, never heard of fear paralysis and post-traumatic shock!? I do recall running to the station attendant, reporting the incident and then running straight to thy friend's house...
* As for men not acting on fantasies, if only one could be sure that access to suggestive pictures of (naked) children and/or adults would give them sufficient stimulation for self-release in private - unfortunately the statistics do not seem to suggest that photo desensitisation-cum-mastr ubation is a reliable method of prevention... |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
12:49 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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PS
* Re the other bloke (naked and masturbating in the car), I can recall this happening on numerous occasions - and that each time we foolishly laughed it off amongst ourselves (as some teenagers are obviously apt to do about a naked wrinkled old fart playing with himself in a car).
Yes, with the benefit of adult hindsight it does seem foolish that we thought he would continue to only look and not touch...
Perhaps our vanity (and ignorance) led us to think he was only interested in PLAYING WITH HIMSELF while just LOOKING AT blossoming teenagers, and that the sad and silly old fool would never take physical advantage of any of us - almost certainly we did not consider that he might be interested in overpowering and assaulting a younger child...
Of course, those casual assumptions now seem dangerous (if not just to ourselves, to others) as well as extremely foolish...
It trust that Gran can see the irony in this particular case, as much as anybody else... |
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By: pedrofromspain
10/07/2008
12:54 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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pretty much sums up what happens.
Nothing really and no harm
unlike real predators who never get caught and do terrible thing! |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
12:56 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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PPS As embarrassed as I am to admit to being so naive at times...and later flippant...and later paralysed by fear: -
These disclosures are being made to highlight the contrast betwixt the apparently arrogant and strong-willed person that I often project myself to be on these boards (as reflected by the nature of the responses) and the way that a less worldy child or adolescent may respond to potentially dangerous situations which do unfortunately arise in the real world... |
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By: pedrofromspain
10/07/2008
12:59 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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most dangerous situations are those where we do not realise the danger?
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By: zardraa
10/07/2008
1:46 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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OK for those that are morally disgusted by art works of naked children...
What law should be passed to deal with this? |
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By: buzzanddidj
10/07/2008
1:50 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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The Classification Board has asked the art magazine which published a photo of a naked girl on its front cover to submit its publication for review.
The attorney-general's department confirmed that the board's director Donald McDonald had used his call-in powers to make the request.
Under the Classification Act, Mr McDonald can use special powers to "call in a publication for classification under certain circumstances ... if the director has reasonable grounds to believe it is a submittable publication," a departmental spokeswoman said.
"The director has formed the view that there are reasonable grounds to believe that the June edition of Art Monthly Australia is a submittable publication."
Under the Act a submittable publication is one that is likely to be refused classification, could "cause offence to a reasonable adult to the extent that the publication should not be sold or displayed as an unrestricted publication," or is unsuitable for a minor to see or read.
If the magazine is ultimately deemed unsuitable, it could be banned under the classification process.
In a controversial move, Art Monthly Australia published the 2003 image of Melbourne girl Olympia Nelson on the front cover of its magazine.
Initial reports said it was a protest against the furore surrounding Bill Henson's photos of a naked 13-year-old girl, but the magazine's editor Maurice O'Riordan has since denied the claims.
But the incident has drawn strong criticism from both sides of federal politics and reopened the debate about photos of naked children being used in public, and whether such images are too close to child pornography.
http://www.theage.com.au/national/nude-girl-art-ma gazine-faces-censor-review-20080710-3cy8.html
Mr Henson will make one of his most public outings since the storm over his exhibition erupted when he launches an exhibition at the National Gallery of Australia this evening.
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By: nessa_sarily_so
10/07/2008
1:52 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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I wonder what they will do about all the babys born naked?
Perhaps we can revert back to the midwife in the dark room days. |
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By: johnnydepprocs
10/07/2008
1:53 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| All this fuss over a picture and yet they cant do anything about a real peadophile who has been given free rein by our courts to continue doing whatever he wants because he wont get a "fair trial", very sad! |
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By: dazedlady2003
10/07/2008
2:05 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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You can be as airy fairy and as artsy fartsy as you want to be.
The FACT is... there are sickos in our society and we share the responsibility of protecting ourselves and our children from them.
While it is true that a bully is responsible for his/her own behaviour, the potential victim has the responsibility NOT to knowingly put himself or herself in danger.
Where children are concerned, the onus is upon the parents to make wise choices to prevent them suffering harm.
I'm not suggesting we wrap children up in cotton wool. However, it is unnecessary for children's naked images to be published or displayed in public. No one will suffer if it is not done. Conversely, the children involved face very real potential for harm if the practice continues.
Children rights to safety and dignity come before artist's rights to free expression.
_________________________ _________________________ _________________________ ___
Hear Bloody Hear!!!! |
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By: us_walters
10/07/2008
2:08 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| I Agree 100% |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
2:13 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| Ditto! |
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By: greatgranswisdom
10/07/2008
2:53 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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<<<Firstly, note that because Gran's post was just below the Y7 character limit, leaving no room for Thy comments in reply...>>>
Sorry thy.....it was 100% unintentional.....I actually had a little more to say....but ran into the "character wall".
Again sorry...but it's difficult to try and imagine what i would have done in reaction to the train or car incidents at that age....as it never happened.
I also passed though childhood without sexual abuse from relatives.....which seems to be almost unusual....given what you hear.
<<<<* As for men not acting on fantasies, if only one could be sure that access to suggestive pictures of (naked) children and/or adults would give them sufficient stimulation for self-release in private - unfortunately the statistics do not seem to suggest that photo desensitisation-cum-maste r ubation is a reliable method of prevention...>>>>>
Has any research been done on this, and are there any statistics?
I'm sure we all agree that the minimisation of the sexual abuse of children, is what we all want.
It's just that I think we need to understand the issue much more, to make effective decisions....free from assumptions.
I personally feel that the greatest betrayal of trust of all, is the sexual abuse of a daughter (or son) by their biological father.... more despicable than the acts of Ferguson.....and in a different league to the instances you describe.
Would you agree?
I hope there's some room left! |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
3:04 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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s>> By: greatgranswisdom
...
Sorry thy.....it was 100% unintentional.....I actually had a little more to say....but ran into the "character wall".
Again sorry...but it's difficult to try and imagine what i would have done in reaction to the train or car incidents at that age....as it never happened.
I also passed though childhood without sexual abuse from relatives.....which seems to be almost unusual....given what you hear.
<<<<* As for men not acting on fantasies, if only one could be sure that access to suggestive pictures of (naked) children and/or adults would give them sufficient stimulation for self-release in private - unfortunately the statistics do not seem to suggest that photo desensitisation-cum-maste r ubation is a reliable method of prevention...>>>>>
Has any research been done on this, and are there any statistics?
I'm sure we all agree that the minimisation of the sexual abuse of children, is what we all want.
It's just that I think we need to understand the issue much more, to make effective decisions....free from assumptions.
I personally feel that the greatest betrayal of trust of all, is the sexual abuse of a daughter (or son) by their biological father.... more despicable than the acts of Ferguson.....and in a different league to the instances you describe.
Would you agree?
I hope there's some room left! <<
LOL, Gran...
I think we can basically agree that we're all floundering here looking for solutions to complex problems which we do not fully understand...
As many have suggested, it is difficult to know what makes the mind(s) of paedophiles tick...
There are certainly the fairly common elements of OCD and the sexually repressed and/or immature control-freaks...
BTW, I do recall that part of the NT intervention was the removal of access to pay TV porn, on the premise that it encouraged child sexual abuse - and that many people couldn't see the direct connection (thyself included)... |
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By: thy.nemesis
10/07/2008
3:12 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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PS Gran, one does wonder at the dilemma of Counsellors of gaoled paedophiles...
But conventional (not necessarily infallible) wisdom would seem to suggest that they would NOT be inclined to provide any material which would potentially feed any perpetrator's sexual fetish or other obsession with children...
Besides, there would be ethical considerations, as to the rights of the individual children in any pictures, for their images to NOT be provided by health professionals to paedophiles under any circumstances... |
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By: greatgranswisdom
10/07/2008
4:26 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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<<<PS Gran, one does wonder at the dilemma of Counsellors of gaoled paedophiles...>>>
Yes ....thy, it's a complex issue.
I read where many child rapists are just amoral opportunists, and don't fit the clinical "paedophile" definition.
<<<<Besides, there would be ethical considerations, as to the rights of the individual children in any pictures, for their images to NOT be provided by health professionals to paedophiles under any circumstances...>>>
I suppose that would depend on the picture and its content.....and whether it was an adult making a decision about a picture of themselves, taken when they were a child.
In any case....it would be "shutting the gate after the horse has bolted", if they were in prison for the sexual assault of a child.
An experiment was carried out, I think it was in the late 70's or early 80's, using the now debunked science of Plethysmography....where an average sample of 400 volunteering adult men were shown naked images of a twelve year old girl, accompanied by a suggestive soundtrack, and 25% responded positively on the Plesythmograph.
I think that's where it ended....the research, that is.
Interesting that the woman who brought this to my attention, said that, of the negatives among the 400 volunteers, many said it was the audio track, rather than the pictures, that they "shut their mind to", to achieve the negative result. This would fit the experience of Naturism, which proves beyond any doubt that nudity, at any age, CAN be totally non sexual. |
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By: kane_u_pain
10/07/2008
5:54 pm |
Message deleted. |
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By: wazzajack
10/07/2008
6:40 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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zardraa
<OK for those that are morally disgusted by art works of naked children...
What law should be passed to deal with this?>
How about one that defines outlawing naked pictures of children presented to be posing in what could be taken as a sexually provocative way.
Quite simple to differentiate an Ann Geddes with a cute innocent intent from something posing as art that resembles the poses of an adult females lead in pictures before the centrefold leg spread of Penthouse or simular publications |
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By: kane_u_pain
10/07/2008
6:44 pm |
Message deleted. |
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By: kane_u_pain
10/07/2008
6:45 pm |
Message deleted. |
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By: wazzajack
10/07/2008
6:47 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| Going by your Helen Mirren post Kane you really add class to the boards. |
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By: buzzanddidj
10/07/2008
6:49 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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'How about one that defines outlawing naked pictures of children presented to be posing in what could be taken as a sexually provocative way'
All depends how your mind works
Is that child crawling on all fours ?
Or is that child posing 'doggy-style'
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