By: spikethru4
2/11/2006
3:59 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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[Whether you are for or against it, the fact remains the MAJORITY have voted against it three times. I would hope Australians do not follow International trends by igoring basic democratic principles when the priciples get in the way of minority wants.]
The fact also remains that, in this context, "majority" actually refers to "slightly more than half" and "minority" to "slightly less than half". The votes have always been close; that's why the issue keeps reappearing - and will no doubt keep doing so, regardless of this outcome, until a SIGNIFICANT majority (more than two-thirds, probably) has its say.
The electorate has changed since the last vote. It is perceived that their opinion of DST may also have changed. In any case, democratic principles are not being ignored here. We've had a long trial of non-DST, now it's time to trial DST again, and then we vote. Majority (however slim) rules. If it's close again either way, expect another debate in 10-15 years' time. |
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By: silicacontent
2/11/2006
4:23 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| murantee the last vote on DLS was over 12 years ago last century, we have a new generation of voters and new arrivls from interstate now all of whom would like a say on whether we have or do not DLS. We vote for our pollies every 3 or 4 years so why not on other issues that appear at least to have opinions changing. I am sure that form my coversations at least 70% of the population would like DLS but I may be wrong so let us have a educational 3 year trial 1 year is not enough and then vote. |
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By: bradus02
2/11/2006
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Having the same debate on the QLD boards, thought I might throw something over this way.
The other points I thought of:
Octogenarian bowlers who roll up at 6.30pm now would be doing so at what is now 5.30. Further exposure to heat (apparently the major cause of dehydration, a common killer of the elderly in summer) cannot be good for people of their age.
Golfers who like to tee off first thing in the morning of a weekend would have to tee off an hour later mean LESS supposedly quality time with theor families and friends.
Didn't think of those things did you.
The second point is of course slightly tongue in cheek but true none the less. The first though is a fairly concerning argument. |
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By: bradus02
2/11/2006
11:15 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| Ausgal, are you from QLD or NSW cause you are jamming the DLS message down the knecks of people on both boards. Make up your mind which state you live in before calling for the rite to vote in a referendum in both states. |
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By: buck11266
2/11/2006
11:27 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| It's time W.A emerged from the "Stone Age" and introduced Daylight Saving as well as Late Night Trading,this state is so far behind it's bordering on Comical. |
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By: buck11266
2/11/2006
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| Achris'what the hell are you scared of,a little extra sunlight never killed anyone yet. |
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By: silicacontent
3/11/2006
10:30 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Buck you are one of the enlightend ones yes let us bring this state out of the dark ages and let us have the same rights as the other states. Why should we not be like NSW, VIC, TAS, ACT. Even the Queenslanders can go shopping in the evening and they have not even made it to the stoneage yet. |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
11:43 am Yahoo! Profile:
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I think ausgal, you and "too much sun already" silicacontent need to decide exactly whose debate you are involved in - QLD's or WA's or is your opinion to be regarded so highly that you feel it necessary to share it with everyone?
We QLDers have rejected DLS in a referendum (poor you didn't get a vote), WA have rejected it three times by referendum (suppose you didn't get a vote their either?). The only half logical reason for DLS is to bring us into line with NSW, VIC and, god knows why, TAS (even though WA would still be two hours behind the Eastern states). My question is why should there be an expectation that just because NSW and VIC have it, the rest of the country should fall into line with them?
A better suggestion, one which requires far less adjustment to the greater part of the country, is to scrap it in the Southern states and bring them into line with the rest of the country. |
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By: silicacontent
3/11/2006
12:29 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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bradus you do waffle on and on even for a banana bender, shove off back to Qld and take the rest of the Darksiders with you.
We having or at least trying to have a debate were LOGICAL points can be put forward from both sides and as you have proven the ANTI DLS brigade have very little Logic in there argument were as the PRO DLS guys have put forward very logical argument such as, time with family, friends on nice light evenings, healthier children, safer driving, less pedestrian accidents, etc. etc. etc. The arguments for DLS are overwhelming even before we start on the pluses for business and the WA economy.
So bradus stop your pesonal attacks on those that you do not agree with and try to use you slightly under used brain and come up with some facts. |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
2:18 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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From the QLD boards:
By silicacontent:
bradus dear the reason why I get involved in the interstate debates is because I am one of the lucky people (I guess) that live in more than one state. I have worked hard for that privalage and just because I have these properties in various states does not take away my right of opinion as we are all Australian first.
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How does owning properties in various states (whoopy doo) mean you live in all of them? Which one do you vote in? I bet its not even WA or QLD. |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
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All the pro DLS debate does is present lifestyle choices and opinion not back by a shred of evidence visa vis the pedestrian accident rubbish.
Show me a link that says more pedestrians are killed on the road in Australia when it is dark from a credible source and rthen I will give your argument some consideration.
I only came to the WA boards to read some of the comments with no intention of posting until I saw that you and ausgal were so I thought to just highlight that point.
I am not going to argue reasons for/against DLS in WA, not my backyard, but please make up your mind which state you live in and contain your opinions to those boards. |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
2:41 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Personal attacks hey?
From QLD boards:
This from someone who has already had enough sun, silicacontent:
"reading all of you darksiders as ausgal calls you, You people are so one eyed, I guess you are all inbred, country yokel redknecks."
and this:
"Up to now I ahve noticed that The likes of ausgal and the others have been polite and tried to have constructive debate but honestly I feel you anti DLS or Darksiders are just to retarded to have a honest debate."
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Is that a personal enogh post for me to be allowed to respond?
And what's this "shove off back to Qld and take the rest of the Darksiders with you." rubbish you are on about now.
You just posted on the QLD boards that you live here too. You really are a sneaky one aren't you. Claiming personal attacks when they have been started by none other than yourself and ausgirl and then claiming to live in WA on one board and claiming to live in QLD on the other.
Shame on you. Make up your mind. |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
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How about you supply a link with the stats about night time vs daytime accidents for both pedestrians and vehicles from a credible source. might give your argument some weight rather than appearing presentation of opinion.
I doubt these claims to be true. More vehicles and pedestrians out and about during daylight hours. Increases the number of statistical variables thus increasing the liklihood of daytime accidents over night time ones. Prove me wrong if you can but that is simple grade 8 maths. |
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By: silicacontent
3/11/2006
2:57 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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The anti DLS brigade use anything but logic
The logical reasons for Daylight Saving
1) I enjoy my light outdoor evenings with family and friends.
2) Time in the evening on the beach is extremely pleasant, In WA I see the sun set it is beautiful.
3) It is pleasant even on ones own sitting on the balcony on those lovely light evenings.
4) The waste of daylight is one main point in the argument, whats the point of having sunshine at 4.30am (none at all)
5) As has been discussed it is beyond doubt that WA & Qld loses business, revenue and jobs because it has no DLS
6) The fact that lives will be saved as pedestrians are more likely to be ran over on a night.
7) The fact that car & truck accidents could also be reduced less night time driving.
8) As a Nation we need to standardise our clocks to remain a constant 2 hrs ahead of the west coast.
Like I have said we do not want to see DLS forced onto a Majority so all we ask is that we have a 3 year education for the uninitiated and then Vote. If the majority do not want it then fine. Us pro DLS will go away for another 10 years before we can try again.
It appears though that you are very FRIGHTEND of such a trial and vote. I assume that is because you FEAR the majority of people will approve Daylight Saving. It will be fantastic for the majority of people in Both WA and QLD.
Any way as you spend no time in WA it is not of your concern |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
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| 5,6, & 7 are only valid if you can give some stats to prove your argument. The reat are lifestyle choices desired by many but utilised by the few. |
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By: ic_lady
3/11/2006
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1. thinking logically how often through the working wee will you spend time with family and friends?
2. what about those who dont live by the beach nor have a smimming pool
3. the summer evenings in perth are already pleasant
4. having sunlight at 4.30am a cool fresh start to the working day
5. im not sure this is true...but if this is the case why cant busniness start earlier?
7. 6. hmmm the days will be longer and hotter when people are driving home from work in the heat wont their tempers will be frayed (causing more accidents..plus...if as you suggest in point number 1. wont there be more cars on the road driving to the beach etc and wont there be more people out and about increasing the chances of being hit by a car
8. why is it that some of the eastern states have day,light saving anyway...isnt it a british tradition? |
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By: ic_lady
3/11/2006
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| should read "working week" |
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By: bradus02
3/11/2006
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As pointed out ON QLD boards re the same list of "benefits" from silica:
Points 6 & 7 are mathematical phallacies.
During the day there are more pedestrians and vehicles out and about INCREASING the chances of accidents. I again challenge silica to post here and on the QLD boards the statistics that prove there are more pedestrian and vehicular accidents after a certain time of the day. If you increase the number of pedestrians and vehicles getting around during the daylight hours surely you increase the chances of accidents. |
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By: k_horth
5/11/2006
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ausga, I lived with DLS for 5 years, from may'99 to march'03, When I lived in Sydney, and wished fervently I was back home in Perth, without it. I have had the debate with my husband, who is pro DLS, and we can only agree to disagree on the topic. My reason is this, I like Perth the way it is, I don't want to see it " catch up to the easten states " with DLS or extended shopping hours, as someone else mentioned. I have seen the effects, Sydney never stops, it's constant motion and noise, and everyone had to be some where 10 minutes ago and your in thier way, in short, it's a rat race, to be the first to find the cheese in the maze.
Perth is a relaxed, easy-going place with no rush and bussle , it actualy shuts down and sleeps, this is why I love the city I was born and raised in. We don't need to be like the eastern states, or to catch up to them, we just need to be ourselves, live the way we want, not become a mini Sydney. |
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By: ausgal951753
5/11/2006
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| Hi K north thanks for your opinion and well put, its a breath of fresh air to have someone put their point of view rationaly with out peronsnal attack, even if I do not agree with your opinions. Give hubby a kiss on the cheek from me because I think hes right. It all comes down to personal likes and dislikes and then to how the majority votes. I am a big city girl having lived in Sydney, London, Hong Kong and I like a city that does not sleep but that is only me, I accept its not everyones cup of tea. I dont believe Perth will ever be like these citys but would like to see what I feel is a simpler easier life being able to go shopping when I want and not when I have to. We had our referendum on 7 day trading and accept the outcome in the short term until the next election. However if we must retain only 6 day trading until then,why not extend the trading hours say 8am to 8pm each day. |
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By: simonchlvrs
6/11/2006
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I have just read thru several pages of this board and can't help but feel sorry for those out there who don't want DLS. I too have lived all around the country, and O/seas and have found that DLS gives me a better lifestyle and less stress. I am able to spend more time with my kids after work, and we even go out after dinner as it is still light. I enjoyed it so much that while I was based in WA I approached my employer about hours flexibility, and started 1-2 hrs earlier than others, just to get the same benefits. As far as trading hours goes, I agree with you ausgal...shops close aroung 9pm/7 days here, and I find it great to not have to rush around after work or on a Saturday only. Upon my next visit to WA (permanent this time) I am looking forward to not have gone so far backwards!
I am happy to see that most people have realised the truths about curtains, milking etc, although I know not all have....numbskulls!! |
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By: silicacontent
6/11/2006
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Simon you are a breath of fresh air if only WA had more people like you, we look forward to your return. You wrote with logic and clarity something the Anti DLS cannot do for some reason.
Now we seem of added 7day trading to the thread the last referendum was done without a trial so very few WA people have experienced the relaxed lifestyle it offers, So how about a trial of 7 day trading as well as the DLS. |
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By: bradus02
6/11/2006
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I am able to spend more time with my kids after work
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Can'play with your kids indoors eh? Mores the pity. |
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By: georgimw
6/11/2006
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From personal experience i know that my toddler would much rather play outdoors rather than indoors. i mean what fun active games can you play indoors with a energy packed 3 yrold?? I feel the same in the fact it will give me more time outdoors with my little man.
but really like i said before, people will be unhappy either way, so for now just bring on summer :o) DLS or not. :o) |
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By: jaykaye_09
6/11/2006
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I am able to spend more time with my kids after work
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Can'play with your kids indoors eh? Mores the pity.
-bradus02
You see, people do this crazy thing with their children called, if you stay with me, sport.
Now, it is a relatively new concept but, in its most simplistic form for example, it can involve kicking a ball between one another. |
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