By: silicacontent
27/10/2006
1:34 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Totally illogicol
1) you still get the same sleep as you go to bed at the same time as you always do. ie 10pm or whatever.
2)Kids go to bed when they are told. How do the kids go in Norway with 24 hours of sunshine.
3) Rural jobs have same amount of sunshine no less no more.
4) A lot of wives will love the extra outdoor time with the family.
5) A lot of children will enjoy the light nights with extra outdoor activity. Might even be more healthy children around.
6) some parents seem to want to get home and get the kids to bed out of their way. perhaps they should never have had children if thats how they feel. |
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By: spikethru4
27/10/2006
3:59 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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[The logical reason for no daylight savings is that if you live further north or are a rural person, you will be getting the whole family up an hour earlier (if they catch a school bus at 7am (alot do) it will now be 6.]
Rubbish - the school buses will still run at 7am; it's just that the sun will be not be as high in the sky.
[Because alot of rural jobs are while the sunshines they end up working later at night, causing havoc to the cook.]
But also starting later. How on earth do these people cope with the natural cycles of daylight hours during the year, anyway?
[The kids won't go to bed in the light]
Parents all over the world manage to get their kids to bed at the same time in the summer as winter. In the UK, the difference between sunset in midwinter and midsummer can be as much as five hours (4pm vs 9pm). Never heard anyone complain about getting kids to sleep in thrity-odd years living there. Invest in block-out curtains (non-fading ones, of course!)
[and everyone gets an hours less sleep.]
Mmm, no. Only on one day a year when the clocks go forward, and you get an extra hour's sleep on the day they go back again. Assuming you're asleep at that time.
[Thats alot of cranky kids and wives, and alot of overworked farmers.]
I'll discount the kids and wives, since those arguments are nonsense. Farmers work long hours at the best of times, but I can't believe shifting the clock actually creates more work for them. And they seem to cope too all over the world where DST is in operation. PS. 'alot' is actually two words.
Next? |
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By: subiaco69
27/10/2006
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******************THE SOLUTION*****************
We create a new state “WA Smallsmind” all the small minded people who don’t want to spend quality time after work with their family and friends can go and live there. Aall the other people can enjoy DLS in piece, and take advantage of cooler mornings, lighter nights and safer roads.
Oh and all the hoons can live there as well, because they come out after dark and that gives them an earlier start!!!!! |
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By: ausgal951753
28/10/2006
9:58 am Yahoo! Profile:
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Yes WA Smallmind or WA Dullsville both titles Fit
We have
No Daylight saving like the rest of the world
NO seven day trading, Tourists to WA think they stepped back in time and have you ever heard of a tourist returning to WA for a second visit. Never.
NO relaxing street cafe bars as you see in asia or europe. Only ancient church driven Sunday trading regulations. |
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By: ic_lady
28/10/2006
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i always find it curious as to why the subject of daylight saving is bought up in the cooler months of the year...i think this should again be raised when we have had 40 degrees days and 28-30 nights...when everyone (including the pro-daylighters) are complaining about the heat...
personally i think w.a. is a very nice place to live...i think the summer days and nights are enjoyable without having an "extension" of daytime hours...its a relief to see the sun go down on a 40 degree day...
just my thoughts... |
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By: ausgal951753
28/10/2006
12:41 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| Yes even us Pro-Daylighters complain about the heat, which is one of the very reasons we are getting daylight saving. We get up and do some of our work in the cool of the day and then on a hot summer evening we sit and relax enjoying a cool wine or other out door activity at the pool or the beach. |
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By: aussiesprite68
28/10/2006
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| I grew up with daylight savings and can't see a problem with bringing W.A more in line with the major business centres of our own country. As for the cry of "I can't get my children to sleep when it's light" huh????? you are telling me that these people have let their little tots stay up till its dark all their lives, who's in control in these families? My kids have a set bedtime, one naps during the day still and they go to sleep whether its dark or light simply because they are tired and they have a routine. |
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By: rygar069
29/10/2006
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http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,2066 2038-2761,00.html
DAYLIGHT saving will not affect children's sleep patterns in families with established bedtime routines, according to an expert.
Myths abound about the effect a time change will have on everything from children's bedtimes, to fading curtains, skin cancer and confused cows.
The facts, however, tell a different story.
Ngala Family Resource Centre education co-ordinator Julie Holschier said children in countries such as Sweden had to learn to sleep in summer when it was light almost 24 hours a day.
She said families with young children could put them to bed 30 minutes earlier a few days before daylight saving began, to get them used to the time change.
Queensland Premier Peter Beattie claimed last week that skin-cancer rates would soar in his state if daylight saving was introduced.
But his claims carry no weight, according to the Cancer Council of WA's director of education and research, Terry Slevin.
The council recommends people stay out of the sun between 10am and 3pm daily regardless of daylight saving. These hours were when UV radiation was at its most intense.
Mr Slevin said some people used the argument that children would be walking home from school an hour earlier than normal during daylight saving, when the UV index was higher.
However, this was offset by lunchtime - when children were also likely to be out in the sun - also being an hour earlier.
Perth Observatory director James Biggs emphasised that daylight saving did not alter the total number of daylight hours.
"It (daylight saving) is just a way of organising our day's activities in a different way," Dr Biggs said.
"It will have no physical effect whatsoever, it will only affect the systems we have in place to run our lives." |
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By: ausgal951753
30/10/2006
11:19 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Thank you rygar069 another practical expalantion why the arguments against DLS never stand up, they are simple myths and personal views. I was once undecided about DLS having never really thought about it except from the point that I had experienced it many years ago over east. However after listening to the debate there is nothing to think about and we should have had DLS years ago. The arguments against it simply do not carry any weight. Come on the sooner the better vote YES for Daylight Saving |
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By: achris60
30/10/2006
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ok... My thoughts, again.
I am against the introduction Daylight Saving for the following reasons.
1. Farmers already work too much. Because their animals lives are regulated by the sun, not man-made clocks, they don't alter their behaviour. The animals still expect to have various activities, let's use dairy cows as an example, as milking at the same SOLAR time. Because man has moved the clocks forward an hour this means that the milk truck is going to arrive an hour earlier. The cows will not have been milked in time... So the truck drivers will have to go back to SOLAR time to arrive when there is milk to collect, so the creamery will have to run on SOLAR time also... Back to Normal time...
2. This is borne out by statistics in states and countries that have wallytime. Because of disturbed sleep patterns (and it does happen) the likeihood of accidents, both work and driving, is higher in the week after the clocks are moved. That's both at the beginning and end of wallytime.
3. Young children don't understand about time changes and still operate more by SOLAR time than what the clock says. Getting them up an hour earlier and then sending them to bed while it is still light doesn't make sense to them. They are grumpier and more difficult.
I must point out (particularly to inst_ed) that I am NOT one of the faded curtain crowd. I fully understand that we don't actually get more sunlight that what is available is moved.
I thought our government was surposed to be the representatives of the people. The people of this state have said NO 3 times. Mr. people's rep, heed that....
For those of you who LOVED IT in the eastern states... nothing stopping you going back there.....
This state does not want or need wallytime.... |
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By: aaronzig
30/10/2006
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| Nice to see the big issues are tackled on here. +/-1 hour of sunlight for a few months. What a disaster...... |
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By: silicacontent
30/10/2006
12:54 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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To reply to achris60
Not more cows amilking and kids asleeping.
Sorry pal does not stack up. Kids in Northern europe have almost 24 hours daylight and manage quite well. Children also manage well in Tasmania, Victoria, NSW, ACT, South Australia. (Even the Queensland bannana benders are talking about it imagine if they beat WA to it gawd how embarrasing). Like I have said before the children go to bed at the same time by the clock.
As far as the cows go if the cows refuse to give milk until its light (which I find difficult to believe Try some artificial light in the shed) as a last resort the milk truck will run 1 hour later by the clock and arrive to suit the cows. I am sure the driver can be compensated for this. However we could get a anti daylighter like yourself to drive the truck then you/he/she would not have to worry about DLS.
Again achris60 we see your personnel feelings grabbing at straws or is it cows and kids. |
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By: silicacontent
30/10/2006
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| Also Achris60 yes there has been 3 referendums many years ago and if after a 3 years trial we have another and the people vote against it thats not a problem life will go on as it does after a election, one side must lose. However remember that more people coming from the eastern states and overseas now live in WA and bring with them their knowledge and appreciation of Day light saving. Also people travel more nowadays and born and bred WA people have also experienced DLS over east and cannot understand why we do not have it here. Finally achris yes if I ever feel that WA is not willing to advance to the standard of living as experienced in other states re: DLS and 7 day trading yes I can move East if I wish or stay here and help this state progress as it deserves to. The choice is mine. |
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By: haveathink89
30/10/2006
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The reason the government must bring in a 3 year trial without a referendum is so that all these backward people here is WA can experience day light saving before they vote no straight away. These are the same people who vote no to 7 day trading and other such issues. Please can you give me some solid reasons to why day light saving is bad?
Its time to move on WA. Stop living in the past and take advantage of the great climate we have here that is very suitable for daylight saving. When another referendum is held in three years i think many will be pleasantly surprised to see that the majority of people will be voting yes. Give it a go, it cant hurt. |
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By: achris60
30/10/2006
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Why do we need a 3 year trial? Why not just 1 year? And why is the referendum not proposed until July of the last year? The vote should be within a month of the end of the trial. To all the pro-DLS people... If the vote is again NO, will you all shut-up and let the issue die for good, or will you try and raise it again in another 10 years? Why isn't 3 times No good enough? How many times will we be put through this? This issue should have been buried at the last vote.... Why are you flogging a dead horse?
Let me tell you again... WA people DON'T WANT IT. We have said that 3 times!!!! Let it go..... |
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By: ausgal951753
30/10/2006
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achris60 We need 3 year trial to let people really see what it is like. Is that what you are frightend of some people might see how good it is and then vote for it.
If the vote is NO then yes in ten years we will push for it again. People and times change. Even us women get the vote now you know. Why do we have elections every 3 or 4 years.
Let me tell you again WA PEOPLE DO WANT DAY LIGHT SAVING 90% of people I speak to would like to try it. How many will vote for it in 3 years, well lets wait and see. I think myself and other pro Day light savers will pleasntly surprised. pleasantly surprised |
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By: ausgal951753
30/10/2006
5:33 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Have any of you Anti Change brigade seen the channel 9 survey which shows over 70% of people want daylight saving
How can you argue against that. I am sure you can think of something, uurr well Women should never have been allowed to vote. Prehaps it is a conspiracy, Do you think some under 18s are voting well they should on this one anyway. |
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By: spikethru4
30/10/2006
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[1. Farmers already work too much. Because their animals lives are regulated by the sun, not man-made clocks, they don't alter their behaviour. The animals still expect to have various activities, let's use dairy cows as an example, as milking at the same SOLAR time. Because man has moved the clocks forward an hour this means that the milk truck is going to arrive an hour earlier. The cows will not have been milked in time... So the truck drivers will have to go back to SOLAR time to arrive when there is milk to collect, so the creamery will have to run on SOLAR time also... Back to Normal time...]
Thanks achris60, this is the FIRST (and, so far, only) rational argument against DST. That's fair enough; there must be pros and cons to every situation. Now we must weigh up the pros and cons against what is important to us to determine which side of the fence we fall.
The reason that the issue keeps coming up is that the people who vote NO in the referenda don't appear to understand the pros and cons. This is clear because people keep spouting tripe like fading curtains, extra sunlight, losing sleep, don't want or need it, etc. as reasons not to have DST. And other people stubbornly believe them instead of working out for themselves what the real benefits and disadvantages are.
A three-year trial will give everyone a chance to see how DST actually works in practice instead of theorising about the nonsense issues. People will see that their curtains don't fade, their kids still go to bed and get up at the same time, that life is generally unaffected by the change. Maybe they'll realise it's not such a bad thing after all. Of course, if the farming issue causes major inconvenience across the state, that will be borne out too and it can be voted out with a clear understanding of why.
My feeling is that as there isn't, to my knowledge, an annual debate as to whether to get rid of DST in areas where it's in operation, the disadvantages are pretty minor. |
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By: achris60
31/10/2006
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ausgal,
TV surveys are inherently unreliable.
The business community that deal mostly with Asia are very much against it. WA is closer to Asia than the rest of Australia. We are currently on the same time as most of our trading partners. THAT should count more for whether we introduce it or not. Not some fanciful whim of going to the beach for 20 minutes! Do the sums... 20 minutes to drive there, 20 minutes to drive home... 20 minutes getting wet. Seems like a pretty poor reason to create so much upheaval every 6 months.
You have taked to people... well done. I have read the results of the STATEWIDE referendums... 3 times NO, NO, NO!!! What part of 'NO' do you not understand??? |
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By: ausgal951753
31/10/2006
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| The NO was 10 years ago last century when a lot of todays interested people could not vote add to this the large amount of new arrivals to this state mean that we have more enlightend voters now to offset you guys from the Dark Side. Which part of its time for a New Referendum dont you understand. If you are so sure of yourself then lets vote and see. Times change achris and not all of us may agree with the change but we should have the right to vote on it. |
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By: jedskipow
31/10/2006
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| If those on in Brisbane and the Gold Coast wish to have daylight saving there is a simple solution. Get your own State or join NSW. They tried it once and local schools changed times to run at the normal time as it was crazy for kids to leave for school in the dark and get out in the heat. |
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By: jedskipow
31/10/2006
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| sorry We have the same problems with people bringing up the daylight savings issue in QLD. They never learn that no is no. |
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By: ausgal951753
31/10/2006
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| Jed - NO last century may not be no now so let us have our trial and vote then we will really know. |
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By: haveathink89
31/10/2006
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How can there be so much opposition to day light saving in WA when the majority of people have never experienced and therefore are not qualified to pass judgment on it. Why don't we stop theorizing about what could happen and just give it a go. If there are so many negatives to day light saving why do other states in Australia continue to move there clocks each summer. How can the rest of Australia be wrong and boring WA be right? In the big picture day light saving isn't going to have the profound affect that some are proposing.
And to the argument that no 3 times should be the nail in the coffin,the last referendum was 10 years ago! Times change and peoples opinions change. The only reason i can think of for why people are bringing this ridiculous argument up is because they are worried that it may actually get the go ahead this time. |
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By: achris60
31/10/2006
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To all who say that because the last NO was 10 years ago, then let me propose something.
Let's revisit ALL decisions taken since, oh I don't know, Federation and send them back for another go... Let's start with giving women the vote, or letting them drive, or allowing pubs to open longer.... Let's WASTE more of the state's money on other dead issues.
Why does a decision that a vocal few don't like have to be forced on us all until the majority cave in to the minority. Oh, that's right, this is a democracy. Where the majority should be the ones listened to. The majority have spoken, 3 times. Let's just let sleeping, sorry, dead dogs lie. What on earth has the passage of a few years got to do with this anyway? Please read this and ACCEPT IT.... 3 times NO NO NO.....
This state has far more important issue to deal with that messing with clocks!!! |
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