By: dallone.ranger
14/05/2009
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| Good post Pol. On the money. |
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By: pol_pak
14/05/2009
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Thugs terrorise nursing home
REBEKAH CAVANAGH
May 14th, 2009
http://www.ntnews.com.au/article/2009/05/14/51235_ ntnews.html
Following edited from the article :
The 56-bed Terrace Gardens nursing home in Farrar, Palmerston, on Tuesday went into lockdown after a gang of youths jumped the back fence and terrorised residents.
Police were called and quickly rounded up almost a dozen kids hidden in bushland nearby.
They were taken to the Palmerston police station where they were later released without charge.
Cdr Rob Kendrick : police had a zero tolerance approach to problem children roaming the streets at night.
Cdr Rob Kendrick: it would take more than police work to crack down on youth crime, it needed "multi-agency co-ordination and solution", which had begun... the problem lay with "parents who just don't care".
"Some of these youths are not from normal homes and police are left to deal with the consequences of their upbringing and actions," he said.
"Violence as a means to an end is normal for some of these youths - it's what they have witnessed and been the victim of all their lives."
"I'm certainly not making excuses for them, but their behaviour is unlikely to change unless the broader, long-term problems are addressed."
- - -
Comment:
Not disputing Cdr Rob Kendrick these youths probably are from not normal homes, so the question is what is FACS doing to change such behavior ?
Must the Police await advice from Family and Community Services (FACS) ?
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By: dallone.ranger
15/05/2009
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Yes read that. I wondered about this bit;
Police were called and quickly rounded up almost a dozen kids hidden in bushland nearby.
They were taken to the Palmerston police station where they were later released without charge.
~~~
What's the point of rounding them up and letting them go again. It's gangs of youths who usually do the bashings in Palmo. |
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By: pol_pak
15/05/2009
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Rounding suspects up is necessary in order to make sure they and entire community are aware Police view what is being looked into as being taken seriously.
Letting them go again may be :
(a) evidence available at the time is not sufficient to charge them, release whilst collect other evidence;
(b) if they are underage other persons required to attend interviews may not be available, so released until other persons required can also attend;
(c) they may be underage to where not subject to being charged with criminal offence;
(d) limited Police powers.
Around nation recent discussion whether magistrates should decide, or refer for another court to decide, whether charges against underage offenders proceed where normal age conditions would not allow.
The problem everywhere is that it's gangs of youths who usually do the bashings.
Statistical evidence suggests a separate approach needed for under 25s... and a different approach than just age at time for determining whether "responsible".
Issue is whether such graying of the barriers is as effective as clearer barriers with far more effective enforcement.
Personally, am inclined to clearer barriers AND ESSENTIAL far more effective enforcement in so far as offenders are called to account with appropriate punishment and education.
Do we punish kids for failed adults, or just for being bad kids ?
My preference here is sending "at risk" children to a boarding school (substitute family), they still go home to parents or relations for holidays, which in short term expensive, however IMHO very cost effective in the long term.
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By: pol_pak
15/05/2009
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Rounding them up and letting them go again gives them attention some psychologists suggest they seeking.
"Look you care, you are picking me up..."
Trouble is such encourages incorrect behavior.
Thus Family and Community Services (FACS) actions really need be subject to more intensive ongoing independant review of what they are doing.
Not so much to be critical of FACS rather to keep them on track to clear achievable goals where FACS needs intervene, needs get these kids and their families redirected towards less damaging paths.
The balance here is not easy. To much attention given to deviants encourages other children who want attention to become deviant.
This why IMHO far more effective effort will be early intervention in a manner which reduces the attention drawn to the inappropriate behavior.
Sending kids to boarding school earlier can be very effective. Does not appear to other kids as so much an ongoing reward for inappropriate behavior - provided the handling is done quietly.
NT really needs at least a dozen such boarding schools for next 20 years IF we are serious about getting these kids on track and active useful members of society.
Such boarding schools need be both academic to ensure literacy and numeracy, and practical trade or agricultural, as different people will react better to different approaches even kids.
To be honest IMHO some of the kids may do better sent to board in another state, to break the connection with peers, just come home during the holidays where can stay with responsible relations or friends families. This need not break family ability to connect, just ensures there is a gap.
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By: mdoinit
15/05/2009
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.... the reaction to the apparent 'terrorists'' flying planes into those buildings on 11.09 for the deaths in Iraq and Afghnaistan.
.... the Australian's supposed public outcry regarding the Port Arthur massacres as to why we have no automatic fire-power (we being the general public).
....the politicians for everything else... |
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By: dallone.ranger
15/05/2009
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You make some good points Pol, unfortunately I don't think the dollars would be forthcoming for quite a while though.
Sending them away may be the best shot in the long run. Of course give them a chance or two first. Sending them to different dedicated boarding schools would be the go, schools with a bit of boot camp built in.
Nothing seems to work at the moment because nothing has any teeth. It is a joke for them. Of course we might be expected to take some incorrigibles from the areas where we send ours. Which would encourage some infrastructure, again dedicated, up here.
Lets do that Pol. |
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By: mdoinit
15/05/2009
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....the boarding schools for breeding apathy
....thos ewho would lst others deal with a problem caused by misgivings of their own.
....
the government for listening to do-gooders who have subverted the strength of the family unit to leave the kids at the mercies of misguided know-nothings |
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By: pol_pak
16/05/2009
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Dear mdoinit,
Am NOT suggesting all children be sent to these schools.
Am suggesting children offending where families are NOT able to control them AND educate them properly so they have the basic literacy, numeracy and english language skills should be sent to these schools.
These are children the courts are seeing as offenders... would you prefer we just jail them to where they can become toys of others ?
Give us some practical ideas ?
Many rural families chose, and pay, to send their children to such schools to give them a better chance in life.
Would you deny them that chance ?
You may not be aware not long ago when families tried send their children to such schools to get a better education than available in the community they were refused on racial grounds assistance available to other families.
You may not be aware how even now families trying to send their children to schools where they believe their children will have a better chance of a better education than available in the community they are still treated as traiters... then again, you may be one of those false accusers.
Such false accusers encouraged children to leave school and join the drug and alcohol party circuit living of centrelink, presenting that as a viable lifestyle.
Certainly far to many of our children thought this attractive - at the time, many as they aged are becoming rather bitter about their ruined lives from going that way...
Others - perhaps the smarter of them, have decided to go back into educating themselves so as to learn now what they should have then....
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By: pol_pak
16/05/2009
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Perhaps the smarter of our uneducated have decided to educate themselves to learn now what should previously have learnt.
Why are they denied by people with attitudes like yours their chance to learn now ?
Why are they denied their opportunity to teach themselves from their communities, their homes ?
Why are we not encouraging, perhaps requiring, all our undereducated, our underemployed, to grasp opportunities to teach themselves from their communities, their homes ?
The internet certainly provides those who wish to learn with as wide a range of opportunities to learn as available in metropolitan Australia.
The internet has provided some of us opportunities to earn money for ourselves previously only available in metropolitan Australia.
Yet people with negative attitudes do not want these opportunities in their communities, or worse want these opportunities for themselves but wish to deny these same opportunities to others.
The cheapest way the NTG can ensure education is available to all in our rural communities is to ensure the internet is available to all in our communities and everyone is taught the basics of how to login and learn for themselves...
Why is this not desirable ?
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By: pol_pak
16/05/2009
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By: mdoinit ...the boarding schools for breeding apathy
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Why are so many of our better educated the ones who attended such boarding schools ?
They are the ones who can skip between the two worlds with least discomfort, to seek, to find, and to take up opportunities they chose to.
Those denied these opportunities are restricted in their choices.
The world is a big pond, for some perhaps to be a bigger fish in the smaller pond is more comfortable than a smaller fish in a larger pond.
The aim is for each of us to have our own choice of which pond...
.
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By: mdoinit
16/05/2009
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Pol_Pak, No i would not deny such a chance at an education, and granted families have trouble rearing kids these days (not all). Boarding schools are grouse fpor some and a tormenty for others.... coming from that background i see boarding schoool truly as a good chance however i also see it as a negative place too for some..
so what choice does a kid have?
though education is seen as the be all and end all for some it is also a restrictive place for some too... |
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By: mdoinit
16/05/2009
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The aim is for each of us to have our own choice of which pond...
spot on ol' boy..
alas the ability to choose aint alway available and when should it be made available?
granted some families have no choice with outcomes they desire..... |
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By: pol_pak
16/05/2009
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No disagreement that boarding schools are good for some and a not at all good for others.
Agree education is seen as everything for some whilst just a restrictive place for others.
Whether a student was fully and properly assessed for personal difficulties is where the difference occurs here.
Most students who dislike education, find it restrictive, do so as they were not properly assessed for difficulties they suffer.
Such assessment may require students travel away to be assessed fully and properly by people who have been trained to do this.
Personally, feel education budget needs include funding sufficiently experienced assessment staff to visit each school at least once a year and review all students not achieving. Or send those not achieving to the specialists.
It is such a small investment that can provide such benefit.
What choices do youth have ?
IMHO, until their reading, writing, counting and oral english achieves our national year 6 average they lose to many options to consider anything else.
NT should have at least one good specialist boarding school for youths failing to meet that standard and from where the specialist schooling not available locally.
Boarding schools have task to support students till they either stop disliking it, or their standards are high enough to return to schools from home.
All our futures depend on getting them up to it ;-)
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By: pol_pak
16/05/2009
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IMHO, once students reading, writing, counting and oral english achieves our national year 6 average they then have available options to consider which pathways they may follow in life.
Here is important continue developing as wide a range of knowledge as possible in order to have wider range of rational choices.
Some things will be tolerated rather than enjoyed, but such is life.
Where is great dislike for a subject, first is this dislike of the teacher or the subject ?
Is the subject really essential ?
Students wishing to reject need learn to present viable alternatives.
We all dislike some who we need associate with from time to time, this an important lesson to learn.
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By: mdoinit
16/05/2009
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pol_pak though in some degree the statement is right however education needs focus around critical thinking analysing and the like to do the nation any good.
Granted the nation needs a place for people of differing intelligence.
The rich and powerful aren't the keepers of wisdom, intelligence, invention, etc so all persons need the assistance to be proactive in society, thus financial assistance for all .
At grade 6 level children still have child-like aspirations and intelligence....
they still need guidance moreover impetus and understanding to achieve a suitable educational outcome.
PS this may not make sense as am being harrassed |
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By: mdoinit
17/05/2009
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....his self-importance ..."Priest in brisvegas is really religious what a t.w.at"
how very anti-Christ of him..
yet this is what people want and it's religiosness, not knowing the scriptures but casting their own understanding and interpretation on scripture.. |
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By: mdoinit
18/05/2009
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| sneaky political power... which has now made it illegal to drive without having your licence on your person or in the car.. |
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By: dallone.ranger
18/05/2009
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| It could also be just another little money spinner for the government, seeing as how it is so common to do so. |
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By: pol_pak
18/05/2009
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Common now in much of the developed world is that it is illegal to drive without having your licence on your person.
Consideration on making photo ID a requirement at all times, even when do not drive.
This largely result of time lost sorting out identities, ages and where required next of kin to attend...
Perhaps the Australia Card is returning ;-)
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By: pol_pak
18/05/2009
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Agree that education needs focus around critical thinking analyzing and the like to do the nation any good.
Also agree that grade 6 level children still have child-like aspirations and intelligence which with appropriate guidance they can achieve suitable educational outcomes.
First step is to make sure they all achieve basic functional literacy and numeracy and vocal english before they end year 6 - particularly for the NT.
Year 7 is seen as a big step from childhood towards adulthood.
Federal move now is pressuring youths to remain at school, in formal training. or in employment if under 21.
Perhaps to minimize unemployed, underemployed, with hope they learn to do things better.
Aim of the earlier education acts was that everyone be able to read, write and count (in english) before they started work, so they could if they wanted to improve themselves with additional study.
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By: mdoinit
18/05/2009
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| jokingly, for any who would think it serious , but maybe, Australia with its limp-wristed take on change, should instigate the chip as an easier means of ID.. |
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By: pol_pak
18/05/2009
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The chip implant for an easier means of ID ?
Not really, partly their invasive nature, when advances in field use fingerprint devices replace need for chip implants.
DNA analysis currently to slow for use in the field, this changing so in the not to distant future...
BTW fingerprints and DNA are tricky to obtain without target knowing...
Whilst covert attachment of micro-bugs to send data to portable receivers are advancing rapidly...
:-O
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By: mdoinit
18/05/2009
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| look at the Mob. it already have a transmitter and receiver can be located via 'satilite' and we all carry one (most). |
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By: mdoinit
18/05/2009
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| ....the snake! |
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