By: gwcubbon
1/03/2008
4:35 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Day in, day out I see stories in the paper and on TV about DoCS incompetence and failing the very people they are supposed to be protecting.
I shook my head and thought "Well that's just typical of a NSW Government Department, total Incompetence."
Until recently I was an outsider looking in, but on Tuesday Feb 19 I experienced first hand DoCS Arrogance and Incompetence.
We have been looking after our 6 Month old grandson since November 2007 after DoCS were informed about a Domestic Dispute involving his parents. DoCS arranged for him to be in our temporary care under a verbal agreement from the Mother.
On Jan 29, DoCS had the parents sign a Temporary Care Agreement for our Grandson to remain in our care after WE reported to DoCS about continual Drug & Alcohol Abuse by the parents. We agreed on Overnight Stays with the parents but only after Tox Screens were done, but we wanted documented proof first.
Two days later DoCS said they Got it Wrong with the access visits. They changed their minds and decided on Supervised Visits. All was OK until 19 Days later when my wife asked for financial assistance and some legal documents supporting the arrangement before he could go on access visits again. DoCS turned up unannounced to remove our Grandson from our care. When I asked why, they said it was because we were blocking them.
Coincidental considering we made complaints to The Minister and Shadow Minister in the previous two weeks. DoCS rang the police and removed him from a loving caring home and put him with unrelated people in foster care without any Court Orders of any kind.
Because we decided to take matters into our own hands and applied for Care Orders in the Family Court, which was heard yesterday Feb 29, and adjourned for Six Months, all of a sudden he was removed because of past Domestic Violence issues.
They have done everything off there own backs so they can keep it out of court. As far as they are concerned WE have no right to our own Grandson ... |
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By: sunbeamer00
2/03/2008
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that is such a worry gwcubbon.....the police could come and remove the child without any court orders whatsoever??
did the boy's parents retaliate and inform DOCS of your past DV issues??
sometimes families cannot conceive that the child can be removed and placed elsewhere with strangers....and work against each other around the department..
did you get a say at all in court?....a delay of 6 months is a long time to your grandson?
hope you can work through this! |
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By: gwcubbon
3/03/2008
9:49 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Well the police only got involved because we told DoCS to get off our property and that they weren't removing J without a court order. They told the police that they didn't need a court order had the Temp Care Agreement and that's all they needed. At that time we didn't know any better and handed him over to the Police so we wouldn't be arrested. But only after reading through The Children & Young Persons (Care & Protection) Act 1998 Section 151 did we realise that DoCS should have had a Court Order.
Yes, It was the Parents that mentioned to DoCS about the D.V after we reported them to DoCS on January 29. The next day DoCS interviewed us and we explained the situation in detail regarding the D.V issue which happened over 18 months ago, yet J was left in our care by DoCS until February 19. Like I said, all of a sudden after we had a disagreement with DoCS they STOLE him from us.
We never got to have a say personally because our solicitor just stood there like a stunned mullet and never disputed the validity of the Temp Care Agreement.
6 Months is a very long time, and it's obvious that DoCS don't give a damn if J can't see his grandparents. They've got us out of the picture now.
I suppose it's their way of getting back at us for making complaints against them.
But we are fighters and we will fight for our little treasure until justice is done and he is returned to a loving caring family where he belongs, not in a foster home. |
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By: saos1n888
4/03/2008
1:06 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| If your house hold as doers his household have a history of DV then none of you guys should get the child. Let it go to a normal stable home without angry frayed nerves... This poor child. |
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By: gwcubbon
4/03/2008
9:06 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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J was in a Normal Stable Home without frayed nerves up until Feb 19.
The single DV issue happened well over 18 months ago, 12 months before J was born, and that was a result of financial stress after my business was shut down by a Pakistani Service Station Owner.
A lot of things have changed in our lives since then. J had never been involved in any DV while he was living with us. J was a very happy and well cared for little boy.
We took him to the doctor to get his needles, We took him to see Santa while the parents went down to the Pub. We stayed home with him while the parents went out on New Years Eve. We've spent the majority of his life looking after him because his parents want to retain there old lifestyle. So because we stand up and fight for J's rights we are labeled as troublemakers. J hasn't got a voice in this matter and we're going to do everything we possibly can to make sure J has the opportunity to grow up a happy and healthy little boy in a good caring loving home, not one full of Drug & Alcohol Abuse or neglect by irresponsible parents who don't care if he's put in a foster home without contact from his extended family. J has a large extended family that adores him and now he can't see them because of the parents pettiness and DoCS Incompetence.
BTW: He's not an "it" he's our beautiful little grandson.
Cheers
Geoff |
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By: reidsays
4/03/2008
9:35 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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"Temp Care Agreement. At that time we didn't know any better and handed him over to the Police so we wouldn't be arrested. But only after reading through The Children & Young Persons (Care & Protection) Act 1998 Section 151 did we realise that DoCS should have had a Court Order"
surely this alone should have been brought up in court?? |
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By: saos1n888
5/03/2008
1:30 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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| what happens if financial, emotional or just the hardship of reraising a chilkd comes about and it happens again? There is no reason for DV.. |
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By: weed612001
5/03/2008
2:38 pm |
Message deleted. Reason: Breach of terms of service |
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By: gwcubbon
5/03/2008
11:22 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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When your confronted with major life changing issues beyond your control that you have never experienced before unfortunately it can happen. No one on this planet is immune to committing DV if and when desparate circumstances arise no matter how good you think you are. Every human being has a limit. No one has full control over what happens in their lives. If & When it does happen it's up to the people to address the issues of what the catalyst of the DV was and deal with it appropriately to make sure it doesn't happen again. Our unfortunate event happened before my wife was diagnosed with Bi-Polar and I was going through major depression at the time. My mother & sister were killed in a car accident 11 years ago today, a tragedy which still affects me psychologically. I suffer from Post Traumatic Stress and I am on medication for it. My wife is now on medication and see's a psychologist. I have done Anger Management courses and have changed medication. We have both gone through counselling and addressed the problems we had. A lot of things have changed in our lives in the last 18 months and for the better. We have refinanced the house to relieve financial stress and I have a steady well paying job I enjoy. Remember all this happened long before the baby was born and there has been no DV issues with us since he's been in our lives. When you become a grandparent for the first time your whole outlook on life changes. Your main aim in life from that time on is to love and care for your grandchild, especially if he is being neglected by the parents. We were chosen by his mother to look after J because she knew he would be in the best care and have a stable life. But all it took was a petty disagreement about money for them to turn on us. At the moment we don't see eye to eye and we have been hurt deeply by all this but I hope one day we can all put our petty grievances behind us for the sake of the child before it's too late.
Cheers
Geoff |
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By: gwcubbon
5/03/2008
11:59 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Well our solicitor is quite aware that we weren't happy with her inaction. Unfortunately I can't speak for her so I can't say as to why she never interjected. Maybe she had her reasons, I don't know, but it's obvious DoCS have their own set of rules which they seem to make up as they go along and they can do as they wish. If they deem you unsuitable to care for a child then there is absolutely nothing you can do about it until it goes to the Children's Court. They can put it off going to court for six months using TCA's. This is the reason they got the Family Court Case Adjourned until Aug 2008. Once DoCS get involved the Children's Court has jurisdiction over the Family Court. Apparently DoCS are the only one's that can apply for care orders in the Children's Court. The only recourse we have is, is to apply for a review of the new TCA which we are going to do using a new solicitor. DoCS and the parents are quite happy for the child to stay in unfamiliar surroundings with people who don't know him, love him or know his ways like we do. We don't know where he is or whether he is being cared for properly. What will hurt the most is if we see him out somewhere and there's nothing we can do for him and he's wondering why he can't be with Nanny & Poppy. Unfortunately DoCS don't care about how it affects the child or the family as long as they get their way.
We just hope he doesn't become another statistic for DoCS already appalling record, but if he does they will just put it down to a lack of resources. Case Closed.
We are now starting to realise that getting DoCS involved was the biggest mistake we could have made and we feel responsible for J being in this predicament.
Geoff |
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By: gwcubbon
6/03/2008
12:04 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Well I wont comment on that otherwise I will be labeled a Racist. So I will leave it at that. |
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By: jsschay
6/03/2008
10:39 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| i know this sounds trite but how about a few positives? What does child think? A lot about you and parents not a word on child's thinking. |
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By: gwcubbon
6/03/2008
9:56 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Actually the child is only 7 months old and is yet learn the art of speaking, but I can guarentee you if he could express his views he would tell the world how happy he was living with Nanny, Poppy and his puppies.
He would say how much he loved Nanny & Poppy cuddling him when he first woke up.
He would say how much he loved getting his nappy changed and feeling nice & Fresh
He would say how much he loved his 2 weetbix being fed to him by Nanny & Poppy in the morning.
He would say how much he loved his warm bottle of milk after his weetbix.
He would say how much he loved Watching TV with Poppy before Poppy had to go to work in the morning.
He would say how much he loved having Nanny Bath him.
He would say how much he loved his Yoghurt & Banana's for lunch
He would say how much he loved his orange juice after lunch.
He would say how much he loved playing with Nanny & his puppies in the back yard.
He would say how much he loved his afternoon naps
He would say how much he loved seeing Poppy when he got home from work.
He would say how much he loved watching Nanny & Poppy eat their dinner and share their Mash Potato with him.
He would say how much he loved Nanny or Poppy give him his teething medicine and Bonjela.
He would say how much he loved Nanny or Poppy nurse him to sleep at night. |
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By: reidsays
7/03/2008
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there IS a terrible danger in a government department being allowed to do this without revelant cause....
that in itself is a worry!!! |
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By: gwcubbon
7/03/2008
1:00 am Yahoo! Profile:
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The saddest thing about it is that the ink had hardly dried on the Prime Ministers Apology Speech about the Stolen Generations when J was Stolen from us by DoCS. I can only imagine how traumatic it must have been for our indigenous people back in their day. Looks like not much has changed.
Cheers
Geoff. |
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By: reidsays
7/03/2008
1:32 am Yahoo! Profile:
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there is a website or organisation started up for grandparents who are looking after their grandchildren....
at least you would be in contact with others and perhaps find similar situations to gain knowledge from????
will try to find name of same |
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By: gwcubbon
8/03/2008
7:15 am Yahoo! Profile:
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| Thank You That would be great. |
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By: reidsays
8/03/2008
9:12 am Yahoo! Profile:
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hhmmm..just googled 'grandparents' and 'grandparents rights'...for australia
and there are so many best if you search through yourself...some about legal rights and others about magazines books and groups....
hope you find something worthwhile to your situation:) |
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By: gwcubbon
8/03/2008
7:03 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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No worries I'll try that.
We've had some positive feedback recently.
My wife's psychologist happens to know some people in the upper echelons of the Mental Health System and they are not very happy with DoCS using a "Mental Illness" like Bi-Polar as an excuse to remove a child from their homes.
I'll keep you posted as more comes to light.
Cheers
Geoff |
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By: ughhly
8/03/2008
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I can thoroughly sympathize with youse,
I have had a history of major depression with severe sleep apnoea, this was used against my having anything to do with my children by my wifes vicious lawyer, she nearly got away with it until the family court appointed children's lawyer pointed out that what he was trying to do breached the disability discrimination laws, particularly as treatment was at that time successful.
My limited understanding of the childrens court would be that as DOC's has started a case you can then apply to the Judge hearing that case for a temporary injunction placing the children in your care (suggest some strict condition's perhaps) as this is in the interests of the child.
This should be a possible work round the adjournment.
Suggest to the parents that you could see your way to dobbing them for fraud if they do not come to the party, as if they have been in receipt of benefits without caring for the kids this is what they have done.
GOOD LUCK,
(Note, you lawyer must also look at the legal relationship re childrens court to family court as my understanding is that Family court trumps all other's in Oz except appeal court) |
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By: tonegunman1
9/03/2008
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Ah DOCS.
Now he's a true story of how good at being a parent DOCS is.
We know a girl, 15 who was taken into care. DOCS thought so much for her welfare that the set her up in a flat by herself on the proviso she go to school.
Needless to say she didn't.
She started however having underage sex with boys and men, drinking alcohol, smoking and taking drugs. All at the flat provided for her by DOCS, the State Government, you and me. This was with the knowledge of DOCS. Her and her friends then trashed the flat and the vacant one next door.
She is now living elsewhere in DOCS provided accomidation and pregnant to a 14 year old.
Yeah nice parents DOCS are.
You may as leave a child in the hands of a pedophile drug addict. |
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By: nibbles.mero
9/03/2008
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| i know what your going trough ive got to deal with docs about one of my children that was taken off me at 6 wks old and now they are trying to keep her in froster care until she is 18. im going through courtv to try and get her back and donig courses. the thing is docs dnt have anything to keep her but yet they do what they wont and get away with it. |
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By: gwcubbon
9/03/2008
6:33 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Quote: "My limited understanding of the childrens court would be that as DOC's has started a case you can then apply to the Judge hearing that case for a temporary injunction placing the children in your care (suggest some strict condition's perhaps) as this is in the interests of the child."
There in lies the problem, DoCS are yet to put ANYTHING to the children's court therefore we have absolutely no recourse until they do. DoCS can keep it out of court for up to 6 Months Using TCA's. DoCS don't give a rats about the child as long as they get their way if you don't conform to their rules and they will chop and change them rules to suit themselves. Just typical of the arrogance of a NSW Government Department.
Quote:"Note, you lawyer must also look at the legal relationship re childrens court to family court as my understanding is that Family court trumps all other's in Oz except appeal court)"
That's what we thought but unfortunately once DoCS get their grubby little paws into a child the Family Court has no jurisdiction no matter whether the Children's Court has yet been involved. |
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By: gwcubbon
9/03/2008
7:06 pm Yahoo! Profile:
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Quote: "i know what your going trough ive got to deal with docs about one of my children that was taken off me at 6 wks old and now they are trying to keep her in froster care until she is 18. im going through courtv to try and get her back and donig courses. the thing is docs dnt have anything to keep her but yet they do what they wont and get away with it"
Don't give up on you child. DoCS will use every dirty little trick in the book to get what they want, but they are also limited to the powers of the Children's Court if & when they decide to go there.
I fully understand the need to protect the children from neglect & abuse but the current laws are too one sided in favour of the ones that are the major contributors to this Neglect & Abuse, DoCS. The minute a child supposedly "Slips Through The Cracks" DoCS go on the defensive using lack of resources. Their excuses are getting a bit monotonous.
It's about time they were publicly exposed for their incompetence. |
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By: reidsays
10/03/2008
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| so sad....that the very department allocated to protect australian children....abuses the position and misuses it's power!!! |
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